COMMITTEE ON ELIMINATION OF DISCRIMINATION AGAINST WOMEN CONSIDERS REPORT OF SAUDI ARABIA

The Committee on the Elimination of Discrimination against Women today considered the combined initial and second periodic reports of Saudi Arabia on how that country is implementing the provisions of the Convention on the Elimination of All Forms of Discrimination against Women.

Zeid bin Abdul Muhsin Al Hussein, Vice-President of the Human Rights Commission of Saudi Arabia, presenting the report, said non-discrimination between people was essential for the unity of mankind and cooperation among peoples in a manner that was of benefit for all. This principle was in harmony with the principles and approach of Saudi Arabia, which followed a legislation which confirmed such objectives and goals. Saudi Arabia confirmed that it never distinguished when it came to dignity or human rights. Human rights in Saudi Arabia were based on Sharia, a natural right for every man and woman. Women were sisters to men, and had rights similar to those of men, and these rights could not be prejudiced or harmed.

Among the questions and issues raised by Committee Experts were whether there were court cases or judicial administrative cases in which the Convention had been invoked; how full equality was compatible with prohibitions and restrictive practices, and whether women were free to enjoy all the rights under the Convention; how the Government saw the difference between “similarity” of rights and equality of rights; that the system of guardianship was an impediment to the development of women; issues related to violence and the treatment of female domestic workers, in particular foreign workers, and how these women were protected through the implementation of international conventions; and what was the reason for the high illiteracy rate among women, and whether it as traditional or economic.

In concluding remarks, Mr. Al Hussein said Saudi Arabia would like to emphasise the fact that it respected women, and protected their rights, and stood against anyone violating these rights. The concept of human rights in a society like that of Saudi Arabia was a concept that could be relatively new, but in reality, all the values of human rights which were encompassed in conventions, with the exception of some reservations such as homosexual marriage, which was not accepted, were accepted by Saudi Arabia. When reviewing Islamic principles, it was clear that they reinforced human rights; the judicial aspect and the religious aspect existed in parallel.

The delegation of Saudi Arabia included representatives of the Riyadh University for Girls, King Saud University, Imam Muhammad bin Saud Islamic University, the Committee of Experts of the Council of Ministers, the Research Centre of King Faisal Specialist Hospital, the Ministries of Education, Social Affairs, Foreign Affairs, Justice, the Interior, Labour, Health, the Public Investigation and Prosecution Department, the Saudi National Society for Human Rights, the Family Security Programme, the Family Security Programme, the Prince Sultan bin Abdul Aziz Fund to Support Women’s Small Enterprises, and the Institute for Public Administration.

The next meeting of the Committee will be on Friday, 18 January at 10 a.m., when it will take up the sixth periodic report of France (CEDAW/C/FRA/6).


Report of Saudi Arabia

The combined initial and second periodic reports of Saudi Arabia (CEDAW/C/SAU/2), presented in one document, says that adopting the development of human resources as their primary goal, the Saudi development plans have focused on education, training, the provision of leisure for all social groups and the promotion of economic stability in order to meet rapid social change. By means of the five-year development plans, the first of which was put into effect in 1970-1975, the Kingdom has devoted its fullest efforts to achieving sustainable growth, adopting all the criteria of development, modernization and continuous improvement. The Kingdom has formulated a set of strategic principles and policies to implement the goals of these plans. The outcomes of the plans illustrate the extent of the concern with the human element and its achievement of prosperity and progress.

The Basic Law of Governance includes a body of rights which it considers to be the fundamentals of Saudi society. It contains provisions pertaining to the fundamentals of Saudi society, the welfare of the family and all its members, and education. It deals with the freedom and sanctity of private ownership and prohibits public confiscation of money and the imposition of taxes and fees unless necessary and on a just basis. Since its foundation, the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia has devoted attention to the social and economic aspects of the family in general and of women in particular, in the belief that women have a special role to play in the destiny of peoples and that no nation can have a radiant future without the conscious involvement of mothers. On the economic front, the State has played an effective role in protecting women against poverty, affirming their key role in the welfare of the family, particularly in the event of the death, incapacity or imprisonment of the husband, or divorce. It has done so by promulgating laws in this regard.

Generally, there is no discrimination against women in the laws of the Kingdom. However, the Convention has been taken into consideration when framing laws and regulations promulgated after the Kingdom’s accession to the Convention or amending existing laws and regulations, including the Labour and Workers Law, Social Insurance Law and regulations on employee leave. The provisions of the Convention, ratified by royal decree, are considered to be a part of domestic law. Accordingly, the provisions of the Convention may be invoked before the courts or other judicial or administrative authorities in the Kingdom. The Kingdom’s ratification of the Convention is based on the fact that its general content is consistent with the country’s approach to safeguarding the rights of women. The Basic Law of Governance in the Kingdom, derived from the Holy Koran and Sunna of the Messenger, holds the principle of equality and non-discrimination to be among the fundamental imperatives of Saudi society. It is stipulated in all the relevant articles of the Basic Law of Governance for the reason that no suspicion of discrimination has any existence in the Islamic religion.

Presentation of Report

ZEID BIN ABDUL MUHSIN AL HUSSEIN, Vice-President of the Human Rights Commission of Saudi Arabia, presenting the report, said the steady efforts made by the United Nations system, including the Human Rights Council and the Office of the High Commissioner for Human Rights and the Committee were effective. The Committee was one of the most important fora, from a humanistic point of view, inspiring hope for mankind, and had become a fora that protected the rights of mankind wherever they were and in whatever manner or form. The success of the work of the Committee hinged on its objectivity, as well as a proper understanding of the cultures of all nations and peoples, particularly that human rights did face numerous challenges, including selectivity, which ran counter to human rights, and had been used politically and was actually exploited by some forces to realise its objectives, and this also ran counter to the nature of mankind, which was one, and was going to a common future and destiny.

International human rights mechanisms, including the Committee, had the ultimate objective to preserve the dignity of man. Non-discrimination between people was essential for the unity of mankind and cooperation among peoples in a manner that was of benefit for all. This principle was in harmony with the principles and approach of Saudi Arabia, which followed a legislation that confirmed such objectives and goals. Saudi Arabia confirmed that it never distinguished when it came to dignity or human rights. The Koran rejected all forms of disparity, distinction or discrimination among mankind. It also confirmed the unity of the human family. Rights in Islam were not only a matter of ethical preaching, but were also in the legislative orders, protected by legislative and judicial safeguards. Human rights in Saudi Arabia were based on Sharia, a natural right for every man and woman. Women were sisters to men, and had rights similar to those of men, and these rights could not be prejudiced or harmed.

It was very difficult to devise precepts and cultural visions and impose them on societies without considering the different values and principles among societies, Mr. Al Hussein said. For every culture, a dignity and value should be respected and maintained. In Saudi Arabia, women played an important role in the family. Sharia made women fully competent in their individuality on an equal par with men in origin, responsibilities and duties. Saudi Arabia ensured laws and acts that ensured a balance in society. Like all societies, it could suffer some imbalances and shortcomings, for various reasons related to, among others, traditions and customs. Whoever followed the development of human rights for women in Saudi Arabia would note that in previous years, very important steps had been made through a multi-disciplinary approach. Such a transformation had been realised in a very short period of time, since the establishment of Saudi Arabia in 1932, and this was a record when compared to other countries. Leadership had granted women a very significant role in Saudi Arabia, and she had reached a high status, thanks to a clear and crystal-cut policy.

Members of the Saudi delegation then made a further presentation, based on a PowerPoint presentation, on such topics as amendments made to several laws and regulations, including the labour law, to improve the implementation of women’s rights and provide more working opportunities in both public and private affairs. Several more important laws and regulations relating to women were currently under review by legislative bodies, including on prevention of domestic violence, against trafficking in persons, a regulation for a Supreme Council for Family Affairs, and a regulation for Household Labourers. Women’s employment rate was increasing more than the total rate of employment. Further work had been done to make primary education compulsory for all males and females, to eliminate gender disparities, and there was almost an equal number of girls and boys in public education. Efforts were also being made for adult education and illiteracy eradication for women in rural areas. Progress had been made in the wellbeing of women, in health care, social affairs, and against domestic violence. Saudi Arabia recognised that domestic violence was an issue that it needed to address, and was researching the problem. Available resources to women included the Ministry of Social Affairs, and it had initiated social protection committees in all thirteen provinces in 2004. The new judicial system installed in 2007 had created family courts which would help women to obtain redress.

Questions by Experts

Taking up the first two articles of the Convention, among questions and issues raised by the Committee were the general reservations of Saudi Arabia to the Convention and whether these could be withdrawn; whether there were court cases or judicial administrative cases in which the Convention had been invoked; whether there was any intention to have systematic training of law officials on the Convention; with regards to trafficking, what were the means Saudi Arabia intended to use to sensitise the population; how women were sensitised and made aware of the social services that were available to them; whether Saudi women were free to enrol in all academic courses in all fields; whether women needed permission from anybody to enrol in an educational institution; whether a woman needed permission to get a passport or travel; if an adult women went to hospital, was she free to make her own decisions on her health; whether university students had the freedom to move alone on campus; whether women were free to establish their own NGOs and contact organizations abroad; how full equality was compatible with prohibitions and restrictive practices, and whether women were free to enjoy all the rights under the Convention; and what were the differences between men and women with regards to inheritance, and what were these based on.

Response by Delegation

Responding to these issues and others, the delegation said regarding the reservations to the Convention, these were explainable, including the provisions of Sharia. While the concepts of human rights had developed, some concepts were still developing, and the reservations led to the fact that each case had to be examined by the courts. In practical terms, the provisions were to be implemented. Saudi Arabia was in the process of establishing a high-level board in order to codify all provisions of Sharia with the aim of codifying personal status and dealings and creating a law. The report and its contents shed some light on the realities of Saudi society, and the delegation hoped that a visit would be paid to the country in order to gain first-hand information on what was taking place. Practices differed in terms of applicability from one person to the other - the Government was trying to ensure equality between all. The work of women in Saudi Arabia had greatly changed, but this did not impede her from performing her religious rights. Islam urged women to learn and work, and gave them the right to take their own decisions. Sharia supported women, and was not against them.

On whether the report had been submitted to the Advisory Council, Dr. Al Hussein said it had not, but the Council had taken part in providing responses. The results of the meeting would be submitted to the Council and to other organs concerned with women’s affairs. With regards to training of the judiciary, the delegation said education for girls began in 1960, and over the past years, it had made a significant achievement, and work had been done to graduate female teachers in order to be able to teach in schools in all areas of the country. The budget for women’s education had exceeded that for girls and boys over the last two years. There were fields in university that women could not study, such as geology, but other topics such as law and engineering were now open to women. There were a number of programmes to train women, Dr. Al Hussein said, and many women had traveled abroad to study various branches.

On measures that would be taken to raise women’s awareness of their rights and how to access them, the delegation said that women were not fully aware of their rights, but an awareness campaign had been launched, and there was a special television channel that aimed to raise awareness and broadcast programmes on issues such as women’s rights and international conventions. The media also reported the debates, and there had been considerable change in attitudes. Women had been sheltered and protected for the last 40 years, but there was now a radical change.

Women had the right to go to a health care centre, the delegation said, and statistics had shown that 99 per cent of the population had access to them. Women could go on their own, and could take decisions as to their healthcare - there was no legal basis to the misconception of them requiring male guardianship in this regard. Women’s enterprises were flourishing. Women could travel on their own, and could have a passport. There was an organisation regulation that they required permission, but it was very flexible, and changes in society were paving the way to change this.

The Conventions signed by Saudi Arabia took on the due significance of national legislation, Dr. Al Hussein said. Bilateral or multilateral agreements went through the same procedures, the delegation said. Regarding guardianship, and the permission and approval of education, it was only required in the case of children, afterwards there was no need for this. There had been many changes - women could register on the commercial register, and set up their own business. There were some individual cases, but they were in contradiction with the laws. Women could always go to the Board of Grievances. On the right of women to set up charitable organizations, there was no discrimination in this regard, and women could set such organizations up, just like men. Charitable organizations that were registered with the Ministry of Social Affairs worked only internally, and were not entitled to present their services outside Saudi Arabia. However, these organizations were not isolated from the international community. On the right to litigation, this was granted on an equal level to those resident in Saudi Arabia, and there was no condition regarding permission, and there were no exemptions or exceptions to this rule.

Questions by Experts

Taking up articles three and four of the Convention, Experts raised, among other questions and issues, the importance of the dissemination of the Convention; who was responsible for policy formulation on women and for monitoring implementation and collecting statistical data on women; how the Government saw the difference between “similarity” of rights and equality of rights; that the system of guardianship was an impediment to the development of women; what was the nature of the Human Rights Commission and whether it was an independent commission according to the Paris Principles, and whether it was mandated to receive complaints and to make suggestions with regards to policy changes; what was the status of the National Committee specialising in women’s affairs, who were its members and how they had been appointed, and whether men and women were equally represented thereon; and who was monitoring the implementation of the National Action Plan from the gender perspective.

Response by Delegation

Responding to these issues and others, Dr. Al Hussein said that the Commission on Human Rights was a governmental institution, directly linked to the King. The purpose behind it was two-fold: the Governor, who was a Muslim, was responsible for every single person in the country, and believed there were excesses and violations of some human rights in Saudi Arabia, regardless of nationality, and because of his responsibility he had established the Commission in order to track these and put an end to them. The Commission was responsible for tracking violations and sanctioning them where they took place. The Commission was also in charge of disseminating human rights throughout the country, and was currently elaborating a programme of work to implement women’s rights under the provisions of the Convention, and to clarify to anybody who had been subject to violations on how to obtain redress. These programmes were in the pipeline and would be implemented soon - the Commission was only in its first year. There were women on the Commission. The Commission performed its work in an independent manner, the delegation said, and had a specific mission with regards to the implementation of conventions.

On guardianship, the delegation said there was a legal basis for this - there were no procedures or articles that required pre-consent, except for marriage or with regards to children. With regards to wardship, it was subject to strict legal interpretations. This matter went back to the male or female to define the term of wardship. There was a distinction between wardship and guardianship in order to ensure women enjoyed all legal protection. Saudi Arabia was foremost among Arab countries with regards to achievements in remedying illiteracy, Dr. Al Hussein said. With regards to national associations, there were a number of these on human rights - there was the National Society, which was a neutral body with no linkage whatsoever to the State. It presented its first report last year on human rights issues, and the outcome of its findings. All laws and legislation, even in Sharia, did not discriminate between men and women. Traditions and customs could, however, impose some restrictions, even on Governments, but this was linked to practical life in society.

The National Society on Human Rights had been established in conformity with the Paris Principles, and it had a Committee to receive complaints, and a Committee that focussed on women and children. One quarter of the complaints received had been made by women. One quarter of the body was made up of women. It was working on a report that would discuss the situation of women in Saudi Arabia, and the implementation of the Convention. There were numerous programmes, Dr. Al Hussein said, to bridge the gap between implementation and the provisions of the Convention.

Questions by Experts

Taking up article five of the Convention, Experts raised, among other questions and issues, in what way would the structural changes in the judicial system that were underway affect women’s access to the judiciary, in particular in the rural areas, and would it make their access to police stations and to make complaints for domestic violence easier; issues related to violence and the treatment of female domestic workers, in particular foreign workers, and how these women were protected through the implementation of international conventions, as there were many reports of violations of their rights; and what were the negative conditions that still persisted in the Kingdom, were they being confronted, and what was being done to improve the situation.

Response by Delegation

Responding, the delegation said with regards to the situation of domestic workers, there was nothing that regulated the way they were dealt with in the Labour Code, but there were executive directions, and numerous decrees had recently been issued on how to deal with this issue. Those who violated the legal obligations or treated domestic workers in an inhuman manner were to be severely punished, in accordance with decrees. Those who breached contracts were punished by being prevented from employment in Saudi Arabia for a period of five years. Those who violated the rulings twice were not allowed to work in the country at all. A new system was being applied - the Labour Code for domestic help, which was being studied, and would be adopted shortly, and organised the relationship between domestic workers and the employer. The State had essentially allowed domestic workers, men or women, when they came to the country to obtain full remedy, and they could submit complaints and obtain the help of lawyers. They could apply to the Grievances Panel or Board of Grievances. Those who submitted complaints could go to certain centres where they were taken care of until the procedure was completed. The Ministry of Labour issued brochures explaining their rights to domestic workers, and the legal proceedings required if they wished to return to their countries.

On whether research had been done on domestic workers, the delegation said this was the case. On community police, during the past couple of days, there had been a mention of establishing this in society, and many women would take part in this body. On current organization, there were female guardians at universities and shopping malls and women’s centres. Stereotyping was impacting the perceptions of society, particularly when it came to women, Dr. Al Hussein said, but actually mentalities had to be changed, and this took time. Saudi Arabia was working on changing the perceptions and beliefs of women, and society was the real guarantor of their access to rights. There were numerous policies and programmes - each Ministry had their own, focusing on these negative perceptions, avoiding them and correcting them. It was the duty of all to clarify the fundamental beliefs, spreading the positive aspects of Islam.

Questions by Experts

Taking up article six of the Convention, Experts raised, among other questions and issues, whether there were any Memoranda of Understanding between Saudi Arabia and other countries to protect the rights of domestic workers; a request for details on the draft law on the rights of domestic workers and what were the punitive measures for perpetrators of their rights; what was the mechanism that foreign domestic workers could apply to for help and protection; issues related to trafficking and whether the Palermo Protocol was followed with regards to its definition, and what assistance and protection was provided to victims; what was the principle content of the National Plan Against Trafficking; what was the Government’s plan in working with the country of origin in particular with those countries from where children were trafficked for begging; whether the Government had carried out studies with regards to migrant workers to determine if they were in the country of their own volition or had been trafficked; and if there were no legal texts on guardianship, then what was the difficulty in eradicating this practice altogether so that women could be free to engage in all activities.

Answer by Delegation

Responding to these issues and others, the delegation said when Sharia had stipulated guardianship, it was in protection of woman and her dignity, but if she was exposed to violence, she had every right to go to the courts or to the police, whether she was a housewife or a domestic worker, without permission of her guardian. However, many women did not know about their rights and duties from the Sharia point of view. The Government hoped that the awareness-raising campaigns launched for women would help them realise their rights. Saudi society was different in terms of its inter-dependence - the family was very tight, and mothers were considered to be the guardians of their children. The best proof was that if any woman wished to go out and needed permission from her husband, then this was for her own protection, and not to constrain or restrict her movements. She had equal rights with men. As for domestic violence, if there was any kind of violence suffered by the woman, she had the right to ask for lifting of the guardianship, and in this case, she was responsible for her own children.

On domestic violence, there was an aim to deal with any case of violence and oppression, and to protect women in society, the delegation said. During the past five years, committees had been established in all communities, with attention being paid to the issue of violence against women, in accordance with the Convention. Women had the right to go to a police station, and there were many forms of protection. The complaint should be transmitted to the relevant authorities, and social workers and psychiatrists could investigate the situation. When it came to a need for shelter, measures were taken without delay, and the woman required no permission from her guardian in this regard. Women had the right to take their children with them to shelter. Measures were taken against those who perpetrated violence against women or domestic violence. There was a law against the latter, and many authorities had participated in the examination of that law.

Trafficking in women was part of trafficking in human beings, the delegation said. There were bilateral agreements with a number of countries, including the Philippines and Sri Lanka. Saudi society was a compassionate society, and treated domestic workers as a member of the family in terms of food and shelter. There had never been major problems in this regard. However, the authorities had recognised that there should be some regulation of domestic health. The authorities had been thoroughly concerned with regards to trafficking and women, and had adhered to international instruments on this topic. Saudi Arabia was in the final stages of issuing and enacting penalties for trafficking, including strict deterrent penalties for the guilty.

Response by Delegation

Responding to these questions and others, the delegation said the issue of guardianship of men over women appeared to have raised some confusion. There were no legal grounds for legal dominance of men over women; there were, however, some religious roots, which were over-used and over-stated. This was a problem which needed to be addressed in the future - there were systems, laws and Constitutions, and these did not include the system of guardianship. These texts covered all citizens equally - however, the problem lay in implementation on the ground, as people got confused between the moral obligation to protect the family, and the legal obligation of equality. Regarding health, there was a misconception that a woman could not sign a consent document agreeing to a surgical procedure, and this was entirely wrong. An adult, mentally-sound woman could consent to procedures on her body, except if the procedure related to reproduction or infertility, in which case the consent of the male guardian was required. A mother could also give consent to medical procedures performed on her children.

There were permanent committees that examined all complaints, be they in the field of civil and political rights, or reconciliation, Dr. Al Hussein said, and they took all necessary measures to consider these complaints.

Questions by Experts

Taking up articles seven and eight, Committee Experts asked, among other things, what was the extent of women’s participation in public and private affairs, including in the judiciary and local affairs, and what women held positions in these areas; what measures the Government had adopted to encourage women’s participation in politics; what measures were provided to give women more career opportunities; whether the Government would engage in efforts which would tackle the obstacles women were facing that were not in the law but were in cultural and traditional attitudes towards the role of women; what was being done proactively to change entrenched traditional attitudes; the need to involve women in decision-making processes and not just expressing their opinions; and how many women were involved in diplomacy and representing Saudi Arabia abroad.

Response by Delegation

Responding to these issues and others, Dr. Al Hussein said that everything that the Experts had mentioned would be coming, as was evidenced by the changes that had already taken place. Saudi Arabia had been closely following the experiences of surrounding countries with regards to elections and other political processes. The law did not discriminate between men and women. Women would be involved in politics, and there would be active engagement by them in decision-making. With regards to traditional customs, these issues were hard to deal with - at the same time, it greatly depended on education, and the latter had brought about great changes. Women were taking large strides, which were hard to describe. There was a lot to talk about in this regard. Saudi women had begun to participate gradually in political life, the delegation said, and were doing so through various means.

Regarding women’s participation, there were female members of the Shura Council, and there was a growing tendency to appoint women to leading and senior posts, including as Ambassadors. Many women had been elected to the Chamber of Commerce in towns, the delegation said. Women had many opportunities to enter the labour market. Some academic associations had women on the board of directors; there were many examples of women assuming leading posts, through the encouragement of the Government, and further developments were expected in the future. However, the post of Minister had not yet been taken up by a woman. Families were changing their behaviour in the face of the rapid changes taking place in the Kingdom. Charitable and civil society workers had played an important role in helping families to change, and to change some negative patterns of conduct, including negative behaviour of men towards women, and helping women to understand their rights.

Attempts had been made to change the curriculum, the delegation said. There had originally been some resistance to girls’ education, to the extent of needing the police forces when opening schools. However, statistics showed that mentalities were changing, and no effort would be spared in this regard. Generally, the golden rule was to bring about the need to learn, to relate it better to people’s lives, and to encourage them thus to study. On the role of women in the private sector in Saudi Arabia, this role stemmed from a basic principle in Islam - women had an independent financial status, and men could not interfere in any way in their financial affairs, nor to take any decision on their wealth or financial rights. There were a large number of business women who had become rich in the Kingdom. Women were independent in financial matters, including investments. Women’s participation in the private sector was enormous.

Questions from Experts

Taking up article nine of the Convention, Experts asked, among other things, whether a Saudi woman who married a foreign man retained her nationality, even if she acquired dual nationality, and if so, why was there no equal opportunity for women to transmit their nationality to their children.

Response by Delegation

Responding to this issue on nationality, the delegation said there was no provision for dual nationality. A Saudi woman only lost her nationality if she adopted that of her husband. Regarding children, Saudi Arabia had expressed its reservation on this matter as the intention was to avoid dual nationality, as this could lead to many problems, and the Saudi system was based on the need to preserve the nation. However, the children of an originally-Saudi woman could present an application to acquire Saudi nationality.

Questions from Experts

On article ten of the Convention, Experts asked, among other things, why illiteracy among women was much higher than in men, particularly in rural areas, and whether any measures had been taken to correct this; further, what was the reason for this high illiteracy rate, and whether it was traditional or economic; whether children of non-Saudi women were not entitled automatically to residence, as this impeded their access to education, and whether there were programmes in place to ensure their access to education.

Response by Delegation

Responding, the delegation said that Saudi Arabia needed to redouble its efforts with regards to illiteracy in women, as there was double the number of schools for men than for women. A large part of the budget had been devoted to establishing schools in rural areas, and mobile schools to provide educational services in remote areas. On education for non-Saudis, the children of non-Saudi families did not have the right to residence, but had the right to access all services, including social services. Official education for girls had begun 30 years after education for boys was established, and thus it was a fact that some women had received no education at all. The State was keen on ensuring that they had access to education now.

When a Saudi woman married a foreigner, she had to get a permit from the Ministry of the Interior, but this was just an administrative process. The children of a Saudi woman, until the age of eighteen, were given Saudi nationality, after which they enjoyed certain rights. The husband of the Saudi woman enjoyed certain privileges. If a foreign woman was granted residence, then her children had the right to residence, the delegation said.

Questions from Experts

On article eleven of the Convention, Experts raised, among other questions and issues, whether a guardian was still used in financial issues concerning women; whether in the future, there would be more Saudi women assuming important posts; whether maternity leave was applied in the private sector as it was in the Government sector; whether women had the right to retirement benefits, as this had not always been the case; whether the low participation of women in the labour market was being targeted and how the equal participation of women in all sectors, not just traditional ones, was being ensured; and the need to provide more information in the next report so that the Committee could better assess the situation of women, such as which positions they were occupying in the public and private sectors.

Response by Delegation

Responding to these issues and others, the delegation said that the requirement to have a financial guardian had been repealed by the Ministry of Commerce, as well as a number of other impediments to their employment. If there were 50 women in an organization, then there should be nursery facilities. However, the number of women in the private sector was low, and this was not yet implemented. On maternity leave, the Labour Code did not differentiate between men and women when it came to holiday or leave. However, in the private sector, there were regulations on maternity leave, including on salary and the length of leave, which was at two months on full salary. A number of measures had been taken to increase the participation of the labour force, both men and women. Great efforts had been made recently to open up centres and institutes for technical training for Saudi women only. A fund for human development for men and women was being opened to train citizens in different spheres so that they acquired new skills in a range of fields. There were a number of civil society organizations which facilitated the training of women.

Maternity leave was six weeks in the Governmental sector, on presentation of a doctor’s report or certificate; in the private sector, the woman took full pay during her leave, and continued to enjoy all benefits. The Kingdom was studying the linkage between education and the work force, the delegation said. The national dialogue was focusing on various matters including the need to employ women as per their speciality.

Questions by Experts

Taking up articles twelve and thirteen of the Convention, Experts asked, among other things, whether HIV/AIDS-infected non-Saudis were entitled to the same healthcare as Saudis in terms of, among other things, access to drugs, and were they entitled to free anti-retroviral drugs as would be Saudi women; how was the distribution of contraception ensured for poor and rural women in the context of women’s right to their own privacy; whether the State provided sexual education at school to young men and women; and what was the situation with regards to abortion, what were the situations in which it was permitted, and whether there were figures on clandestine abortion in particular with regards to its links to maternal mortality.

Response by Delegation

Responding to these issues and others, the delegation said HIV/AIDS was not a major problem, and only one fourth of the cases were among Saudi citizens. The healthcare delivered to both Saudi and non-Saudi women was identical. Anti-retroviral therapy was delivered to both groups equally, and free of charge. Contraception was distributed in the same way in rural and urban areas. Advice was given through the healthcare system, and contraception was very cheap, and not a burden on the family. About 80 per cent of the population was aware of different methods of contraception, and about 30 per cent used it. Female healthcare officials were available in the same proportion as men. If female patients wished to consult a female health practitioner on a sensitive issue, then they had access to such a practitioner.

Sexual education was not yet part of the universal curriculum, the delegation said, although biology and the structure of the human body was taught. Abortion was permitted if the pregnancy was less than six weeks, and if there was a genuine reason for abortion. After six weeks, the pregnancy had to be a major threat to life for abortion to be performed. Saudi Arabia aimed to protect the right of the foetus, unlike other countries which protected the right of the woman.

Questions by Experts

On article 14 of the Convention, Experts asked, among other things, what was the figure for illiteracy among women, in particular rural women, and what was being done to eradicate this; a request for further details on the Government initiative for women in rural areas, in particular on the labour issue; whether there was a quota for rural girls and women in education facilities; whether rural women had tax breaks to launch new businesses; whether there were separate programmes for elderly and disabled women in rural areas; whether more details could be provided on the services given to rural women by the Government initiative and civil society organizations; how many people were involved in assisting the rural community; whether women had the same right of ownership and inheritance of land in rural areas as did men; whether there was any information on the division of domestic labour in the rural areas; and whether there was a programme encouraging women to engage in revenue-making activities.

Response by Delegation

Responding to these questions and others, the delegation said with regards to HIV/AIDS, there were almost 8,000 cases. The first case to be reported was in 1983, and there had been a lot of cases, 30 per cent, due to blood transfusion. However, there were no documented cases of this form of transmission since 1985. Saudi Arabia had the highest rate of coverage for immunisation for children, as it was linked to the birth certificate, which was only attributed when all vaccines had been given. There was currently a major awareness campaign being carried out in all areas on breast cancer. All primary health care centres in every area provided health care to the child and the mother and both post- and pre-natal care. Education on fertility was provided by doctors, nurses, clinics, and the primary healthcare centres.

On the maternal mortality rate, for a long time most of the deliveries were made in healthcare centres, or were at least supervised by healthcare providers. However, studies needed to be carried out to determine whether mortality rates were different in different locations. Information on family planning was available to married and engaged women, but this information was not volunteered, as Saudi Arabia wished for a greater population. There was not much land ownership for women, as they were not bread-winners, and were confined to housework. However, pioneering measures in this field had begun. With regards to elderly, disabled and needy women, there were projects that were still underway, and bank loans and funds were granted without interest to encourage micro-credit projects both in and outside the home. Private banks also extended bank loans to rural women.

Questions by Experts

Taking up articles fifteen and sixteen of the Convention, Experts asked, among other things, the apparent difference in rights with regards to identification cards between men and women; the need for family guardian approval for women and children to obtain a visa to travel abroad and the fact that this seemed to contravene the freedom of movement, as did the ban on driving for women; that segregation affected employment, and whether the fact that there was no legal basis for this was widely known by the public; whether women were allowed to practice law even though they were now allowed to study law; what was the role of women in the Family Courts and whether they could represent other women as pleaders in those courts; whether the Government was encouraging changes in the Sharia system in respect to women’s freedom to choose their partner, and to divorce, as forced marriages appeared to persist; why there was no minimal age of marriage; and whether family property was divided equally upon divorce.

Response by Delegation

Responding to these issues and others, the delegation said with regards to marriage, divorce and other rights, as far as the Saudi woman, once she was married, she had equal rights to Saudi men. She had the right to choose her husband, the right to keep the house on divorce. She also had the right to ask for divorce, and could seek a judge to pronounce upon this. With regards to custody, divorced women had the right to ask for financial help from the husband as long as she retained custody of the children. The child remained with the mother until it reached the age of majority, unless the mother remarried in which case it was returned to the father or to another member of the family. With regards to the age of marriage, there was no minimum age. Because of the great development in the field of education, the average was 21 for women and 24 for men, but there was no law on this. Everybody who was to marry had to undergo a medical examination, and if the age was an impediment, then the doctor could deny the certificate.

Islam had sanctioned polygamy, the delegation said, with some restrictions, namely of the number of wives, and the equal treatment of the wives by the husband. This was because of men’s strong sexual desires, or their wish to have children in case of being married to a barren wife. Polygamy was a necessity to enable women to lead a normal life. Polygamy was ethical, as it did not allow a man to have sexual relations with any woman other than his wife, and was humanitarian, as it provided for women to be wives and to be treated as such, and provided for. Many scholars in the West had confirmed the soundness of this approach. This subject could be interpreted in multiple ways, Dr. Al Hussein said, repeating that polygamy was only sanctioned if the wives were treated equally. Some women preferred to be a second wife rather than living alone. With regards to the issue of driving, in the early stages of Islam, there were no cars, and women rode camels or donkeys, and participated in all walks of life. This was history, and could not be forgotten. The matter was not related to Sharia. However, the problem was not related to the laws of the State, it was a matter for society. When people and the mentality were ready, then women would be allowed to drive cars. Once there was a need for women to drive, then it would be permitted. The Government was worried about women, and this was why those who were responsible were against the idea of women driving cars.

On identity cards, the new ones should be given to a woman once she was formally identified, and there was no need for approval by the guardian, the delegation said.

Concluding Remarks

Zeid bin Abdul Muhsin Al Hussein, Vice-President of the Human Rights Commission of Saudi Arabia, in concluding remarks, said he wished to emphasise a number of things. First, Saudi Arabia had greatly benefited from the dialogue with the Committee, which had presented many remarks and observations on the Convention, and Saudi Arabia would revise all of these, and see that all remarks were implemented. Saudi Arabia would like to emphasise the fact that it respected women, and protected their rights, and stood against anyone violating these rights. The concept of human rights in a society like that of Saudi Arabia was a concept that could be relatively new, but in reality, all the values of human rights which were encompassed in conventions, with the exception of some reservations such as homosexual marriage, which was not accepted, were accepted by Saudi Arabia. When reviewing Islamic principles, it was clear that they reinforced human rights. The judicial aspect and the religious aspect existed in parallel. The fear of judgement made people deal with each other honestly.

For use of the information media; not an official record

CEDAW08006E